30 questions from our users
Hi, we are thinking to get a heat pump system for our place. We have three bathrooms (one of which is used infrequently for visitors). Will the heat pump heat enough water for showers for all these bathrooms, if we have a full house? Would hate for people to have a cold shower.
Who can fix mine, I live in Lancefield Vic, it loses pressure and water goes warm, Sanden inform me they do not have anyone in my area
Where would the ideal spot for a ring main return be plumbed in on a Sanden heat pump...?
Would it be (A) where the hot water goes in to the cylinder from the heat pump, (B) where the cold water comes out from the cylinder to the heat pump or (C) where the cold water enters the cylinder from the main cold water supply...?!
how much does it cost
I think they only offer them through a firm that is qualified to install the unit. My main benefit was coupling it with daytime solar power installed separately but just after the Sanden.
$2800-4490 for standard installation depending on which subsidies you can get. 4390-4490 is probably more the normal but some people (ie electric hot water service retirement in Vic can get $3890 or even $2890 with the solar vic rebate (if they're not claiming it already for solar panels) - pricing valid July 2020
Does the unit/cylinder come with a valve kit?
suitability of the Sanden Eco heat pump in victoria 3133
Not sure about VIC 3133 but here in Tenterfield, northern NSW tablelands (880 metres up with frequent winter frosts and occasional snow) our Sanden has been working brilliantly with no shortage of hot water. We are 2 adults but with frequent guests and the Sanden works from 6am to 7pm to maximise use on solar as we have an 8 kWh system.
It should be no problem as it does not work off direct sunlight hitting it but ambient air temperature. Our compressor is on the sheltered cold southern side of our house in coastal Sydney and plentiful hot water.
In ambient air of 20 ºC Sanden says it takes approx 4 hours to heat 315 L of water from 17 ºC to 63 ºC. Usually the tank will be cold at the start of cycle so the time taken is very much less to raise it to 63oC.
Can you use a sanden split hot water heap pump with an off grid system? Is this a feasible choice for residential hot water with an 8kW solar array?
Not certain but our system runs from 7.00am til dusk so although we are grid connected also with an 8.0kW solar system we never run out of hot water. 3 adults, 315L Sanden tank. Hope that helps.
Our system is programmed to run between 10am and 4pm (no earlier as Solar will not be available). Majority of the time ours runs from our 4.25 kW Solar Panels. If there is insufficient power due to overcast sky and none from the grid, I would assume it won't run and your system will not heat. However, as the storage tank is 315 L, you should still have hot-warm water for a day or more depending on your usage. As for tank water, you should test pH it as it may affect the life of a storage tank. https://www.sanden-hot-water.com.au/water-quality
A major cost saver for us was no plumbing installed in the roof as it is all installed on the ground.
The manufacturer should be able to answer more specifically.
I have had a Sanden Eco Plus 315L installed in Melbourne Victoria, we had fantastic water pressure before installation. But since installation our hot water pressure or flow has dropped by more than half. We used to be able to operate two showers at the same time with little noticeable difference, now we can barely run one. The cold water pressure is fine. Any ideas? I’ve called the installer about a month ago but we still haven’t had anyone come to check it out. (First it was they are on Christmas break understandably, and then just to busy with more urgent work to even give us an appointment time, now he is waiting for his plumber to get back to him after the third exchange of emails with me?
The pressure drop suggests the stainless steel filter at the cold entry point is clogged. This is a very common fault in Sanden heaters. You can find this at the point where the cold water enters the heater. After shutting off the mains supply and relieving pressure this can be taken off ising a set of multigrips or similar, and then cleaned. If left dirty it can lead to the dreaded System 40 error and the heater will shut down. I would suggest turning off the unit power for this process. Unfortunately I have learnt this while trying to get my Sanden to stop shutting down; although common this wasn’t the problem with mine.
Another issue that may occur with Sanden units, although I was informed it was corrected on more recent units, is there is a pressure reduction valve in the system. If your problem was immediately after the installation this may be the issue. I would not recommend removing this yourself unless your handyman plumbing skills are exceptional, but its a very simple task for a skilled plumber. I have no idea how that would affect your warranty.
We have never experienced any pressure problems since installation (May 2017) but the town water here (Tenterfield, NSW) appears to be of good quality although being at the top of a hill in a small town the water pressure is not brilliant at the best of times. The E040 error code is lodged in my mind, however, and I am prepared for it should it arise and Tony R's response above seems clear and perfectly logical to me.
Sanden 315 Eco system ~June 2013 $3500
Fault: E071: Fan motor revolution error ("Replace fan motor" GAU-A45HPA inst manual)
"If that action does not solve the error problem, a malfunction of the PCB controller is highly likely."
Heat pump is functioning OK but the fan starts up, reaches full speed, then falls back to 0 RPM, repeats; cycle ~ 3x/min.
New service co visited, confirmed my obs, then consulted Sanden who advised fan motor replacement=$560.
According to the manual, a new PCB needed if the fan motor NOT guilty.
A saving of about $1000 over the 5 years, a capital cost of $3500. Electricity down from ~65KwH/qtr to 15 (off peak rate)'
Wasn't worth it.
A new fan would pay back only if the system's OK for a further 3yr, longer if I need a new PCB and get to keep and pay for a new not-really-needed fan.
I like heat-pumps, but what you have pointed out is the ridiculous cost of imported spares into Australia. That electric fan must have a >1000% markup on it. Maybe the only solution is to have a 'star-rating' system, whether heat-pump units, or imported cars, where the cost of spares relative to initial purchase price of whole object is ranked. Sanden seem to be following the example set by the major European car manufacturers. Another option would be an Aust/NZ standard that the sum of parts costs cannot exceed 250% of a total unit's initial purchase price, if the item is to be bought by any level of government, or included in any government project. That pricing would then need to be available to the public at the same rates. The idea of 'free market' rip-offs has to end.
What is E0401 error on sanden hot water heater?
From page 22 and 23 of the installation manual
The E040 and E041 error codes indicate HP water outlet over temperature
Check the heat pump piping filter for
- Check for any piping bend, blockage or
- Inspect for frozen pipes
- Ensure mains water supply is available
- Ensure all shut off valves are open
- If the water circulation pump is not
working, replace the pump
It is very likely to be the piping filter which can be washed and reinstalled
There is no E0401 error code. Error code only have 3 digits. Perhaps the extra 1 indicates the number of times the E040 error has occurred, or it is a typo
A previous update to a review noted the following that could cause a problem:
I am happy to report that since the latest service call out I think our technician has solved our problem. Apparently there is a valve that mixes the hot and cold water (??) and it was faulty. Whatever the reason, our heat pump is now working beautifully and we have not run out of hot water again.
Looking for a reputable installer on Mornington Peninsula, Melbourne Aust?
Can it affect water pressure in shower?
Yes, it did for us - quite a significant difference. We no longer have to use an auxiliary pump to get good pressure in the showers. Our cold water pressure was always adequate, and now the hot water pressure is very nearly as strong.
It has affected the pressure in the shower in the negative I go straight in shower when I get up to help me wake up with a good invigorating shower!! I am extremely upset and want to know if pressure can be increased ?
Yes you can adjust the 4-Way NRI-PRV to increase pressure. However usually the problem isn't a lack of pressure but unbalanced pressure. Australian Standard pressure is 500kPa (meaning a water line on a dam 50metres approx above your house) and if you check the plumbing codes ie VBA in Victoria it is law to have 500kPa water. Problem is that for fire fighting your water authority often gives you 700-1200kPa. You can complain to them but they will tell you to fit your own reducer immediately after the water company meter. This is a normal thing to do to get AU standard water. A 500kPa pressure limiter costs $50-$80 at Bunnings or plumbing supply stores. Usually plumbers will charge $200- $300 to install one. The final possibility is some filings or gunk got into the pipes during the install which has blocked up the tempering valve (the safety valve that limits water temps to 50C) In this case things need to be checked and cleaned. Most likely though is pressure mismatch between cold (700kPa or some other high number) and Sanden hot (Australian Standard 500kPa)
Installed a Sanden split heat pump system for a customer last week in Taree NSW and after the connection ( Duo valve, supplied pressure reduction valve, cold water relief valve, supplied tempering valve etc ), electrical hook up, filling process etc the system doesn't hold a constant pressure.
I get a steady stream at first out of the shower however within seconds the pressure drops to a dribble.
have contacted Sanden and the company from which my customer purchased the unit from with no result.
I am a licensed plumber, drainer, gas fitter and my licensed electrician hooked up the dedicated circuit for the install.
Please help. My customer paid extra for a valve kit which consisted of the tempering valve, pressure reduction valve etc.
My assumption after numerous times running through the entire install is that the pressure reduction valve is faulty ?
Please return your response to
Yes the Pressure reduction valve was faulty.
Heat exchanger systems require certain amount of pressure to operate consistently.
After contacting the company who sold the system, their rep and Sanden themselves and receiving no answers what so ever and being pushed aside by all involved, I focused on the brand new pressure reduction valve and replaced it with a pressure limiting valve after the rep of the company telling me to " just take it off and bridge it ".
The correct working pressure was restored and so far so good. No help to Sanden who I believe still owe the customer a reimbursement for the extra money they had paid for the valve kit and also my extra time.
Hi Matt I’m a plumber installing Sanden for the last 4 years and have occasional failed combination valve. The valve is not a Sanden product ans as plumbers we can use any brand of valve we want as long as it meets Australian Standards. The valve brand that you can by in a quick kit is AVG.
I have called AVG on these failures and they have supplied a new valve and paid me to change it over.
On another note I have had problems on some of the earlier unit I put in, some, not all units displayed error code40 which is a blockage in the flow and return pipes between the compressor module and the tank. It turned out to be the non return valve on the flow and return lines. The spring pressure is too high. Apricus solar also used these valves and they had problems too. I do not put them in as it’s a no brainier, it’s an obstruction to the flow. It only takes a small amount of calcium build up to make is stick shut. No flow equals compressor shut down.
In a review from someone in WA saying Sanden was rubbish and only gave then a 1 star rating said they were on bore waters. Bore water would have a high mineral content and would have caused the non retrenchment valve to jam. This person said they had a number of service calls to fit it. From this persons review it was easy to tell they were very disappointed with Sanden.
As a professional plumber im disappointed in the customers attack on Sanden when the problem is with the plumber.
I am considering a Sanden heat pump system for a new build in Ballarat with PV panels. Am wondering how hot the water is especially in the kitchen and if there is a distance between the areas requiring hot water, bathroom and ensuite?
Mine has been in several weeks now
The water is hotter to my upstairs bathroom thzn my old hws
A lot depends on the temp settings of your termepering valve
Not mater how hot the water tank is
It's diluted with cold from tbrctemlering valve
Overall it's going very well and I'm happy with it
Compared to a new normally functioning gas or electric unit. If the tempering valve is set to 50C approx then it's the same as any new system with the added advantage it will use 82% less electricity than a conventional electric storage and 87% less than a gas hot water service. (and you can kick gas out of your life if you have a Sanden which is all the rage now).
Hi I have a question. I replaced our old Rinnai gas water tank with Sanden heat pump. I live in Canberra It has been running great until now. In the night it has been very noisy and wake us up. It's also releasing lots of water. Is it right? We get -7 degrees in the night and also get very hot in summer.
Ours is super quiet. We did have a problem with our tempering valve making noise, but that was only when you had the hot water running, and really has nothing to do with the Sanden unit at all. You will need to call your plumber!
Hi Ravinder, my units pressure relief valve has operated a couple of times, but the heat pump unit is whisper quite. I need to go right up to it and feel the air flow before I can hear it going.
I'm on tank water and suspect that the relief valve may have been opening in response to water hammer events caused by abruptly shutting off flick mixer taps and/or the washing machine fill solenoid shutting off on our Grundfos submersible pressure pump causing a line pressure spike.
Monkeygirl is on the money - call the installer and have them check the system before it potentially does more damage. Good luck, hope you sort the issues and get back to trouble free operations.
I have got a sanden heat pump HW installed recently. It works really well. But I found the water is too hot for me. Is there a way that I can adjust the temperature? Do I need to call in the supplier?
Normally the temperature is set by the installer in accordance with your local govt regulation. The temperature of the hot water is measured at the nearest outlet (tap) from the hot water tank. But if you think the water is too hot you can ask the installer to re-check the set temperature. I taught the same about ours after it was installed but it is more about how much efficient the Sanden is compared to the Rheem heat pump we had before.
As mentioned the installer can adjust that for you, how ever i would happily swap yours for mine as mine is never hot enough and keeps faulting ??
Make sure you have your tempering valve wound out to 50C. Or if it's too hot you can mix it down to 40C. The AGV standard tempering valve supplied has a manual available on the AVG website. If you don't have a tempering valve and it's 60C where you are then you do not have safe Australian Standard hot water and it's questionable whether your installation was legal.
How much of a difference does the air temperature where the compressor is, make to energy efficiency? I have a choice of putting compressor separate in a NW facing carport that is warm all year or beside tank which will be in shade all year and in an outdoor passage with breezes. It can get to -5C in my suburb of Sydney and up to 45C in summer. The carport will be more stable in temperature and slightly warmer at all times.
Question 2: Can i alter the times that the tank heats or does it need an electrician? A large tree shades my solar panels midday in winter but not summer so I would change heating times to compensate for this. Also can the temp of water be low? I currently run my old gas hot water on 2.5 and after turning it down to this I halved my gas bill.
The origination of the unit is not worth considering, the air temp is the same weather you are in the sun or not. Also worth noting is the amount of time it will run, for a 200 liter daily hot water usage it will run for two-three hours max.
Need a electrician to adjust the block out time, refer above as I don''t think it will be required and no you cannot adjust the temp, however you could adjust the temper valve for this, refer this to your plumber.
Email me if you require more info. [email removed]
Thank you! I put the compressor in the carport anyway as it is out of the weather and they have adjsuted the timer so it only heats during the day. I may change that at some later date as I notice it comes on around 0830 and the sun is not as strong in winter at this time. It is working really well. am happy with the installation tradies, they were excellent, and its working efficiently. will be interesting to see the next elec bill for comparison with last year. Thanks again.
Under cover is the best option especially in cold areas subject to frosts. I would also look at going a location that has the shortest pipe run between the compressor and the tank and the shortest pipe run from the tank location to your services (ie bathroom kitchen and laundry) though for economic reasons where your existing tank is currently located is often the best location if you're on a tight budget.
How much cost to install 170l heat pump in Melbourne Victoria? Is that any government incentive?
Hi Mike - I don't have details at hand just now. Total cost was about $3,100 installed, including rebates. This is for Victoria. After we did the sums on power saved and the cost of off peak electricity for our old HWS, the heat pump made good sense. I hope this assists.
G'day Mike, Basically, one just needs a water supply, and Power Outlet - Amp should be @ 15, for the supply, and continuous supply. Combine with Solar Power panels, cost to run is minimal.
Therefore - cost to install : if new building, minimal. If existing, depends what's already in the location.
There's a Federal 'STC' rebate for Heat Pump Hot Water, and in Vic - only if you're replacing an existing Electric Storage, another rebate applies - 'VEET'. Cheers
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